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Is it possible that CCD may be initiated by a petit mal or TIA? Possum's big appointment is March 8. We are dealing with a hospital who believes her issues are genetic. This is EXACTLY why I bring Gabriel with me to all foster pups' appointments, to show what a well-adjusted, IDENTICAL genetic defect, exceeding and excelling. This is her big hurrah, as we have fought for her well-being for almost a year. Doc felt last summer her flooded colon and CCD and various issues were genetic. This was on a phone consult for the colon which ended on his statement: This is genetic and but the TIP OF THE ICEBERG" (we have work to do on the 8th, but I CANNOT attend the visit, a seriously emotional personal issue that I MUST attend to that morning conflicts with her appt, so Christy and Donna are taking Possum and Gabriel to the vet... Yes, my personal issue deals with my dead son, so it is not something that can or will be re-arranged ~ my late boy, Andy, trumps everything on this earth), so I didn't get into the genetic defect, but we are now going in for the big one. I want to know the WHY of her profound CCD which has accellerated to aggressoin and the entire family and pack is living in fear of her attacks. I talked to an Aussie show person a few days ago who put down a dog she said suffered from the same thing, but what that dog suffered from sounded to me like deafness and blindness and no understanding of those handicaps, ie, the dog didn't do well in that particular situation, altho another deaffie she rescued from death at the shelter, a dog I posted on LWAR-C is happily living in Florida.
I want to know if CCD may be caused by the misfiring in the brain. Nothing on my hard drive i ndicates the behaviour Possum presents. Nothing. However, doesn't it sound plausible?
We will be fighting for Possum's life on the 8th. I know more than I ever thought I could about CCD, and treatments. Possum's aggression has taken this to a new level. She needs an Rx, which they would not give me the last time we went in. I think their feeling was I was being cruel in keeping her alive.
My life is devoted to educating everyone I come across, and that includes my medical professoinals. My last vet's tech chewed me out for not destroying a blind pup, so you can see we have an uphill struggle here in the deep south.
Can I feasibly suggest seizure as a trigger? I have to know the why, before I have to face my biggest fear, that I am being cruel. I want to try drugs, we have tried ALL OTCs including zinc (which helps curb aggression, excitability and overactiveness), and she has had, both: diazepam andalerazolam. Possum tried both, and there is NO difference between her dosing state and her regular state. Which is manic.
She is not tranquilized or calmed. She can do stairs, spin, attack, spin and do stairs just like her 'normal' So we are not sure they do not work, because it may be inadequate for her.
Her mental state has not improved.
I think there is a trigger. I just don't know what it is, and it is constant to her waking state.
As you can see, she does have some tremendous moments, as she did on the agility track in October with her mentor, her believer, and her trainer, Christy Mullady:
Who is the dog being dressed up, that's not Possum is it?
I don't know anything about seizures in dogs, but I found this.
"Psychic seizures affect how dogs feel, think and experience things. Psychic seizures can evoke spontaneous emotions like extreme fear or aggression. A seizure should be suspected for any dog who exhibits brief periods of unprovoked, extreme fear or aggression."
You are an to keep advocating for Possum all this time, and I wish they would give you more help! It just seems like this can't be her fault... Look at her when she's happy...
Her magical moments are MAGIC! You would not believe these two dogs are the same! I am very excited about your link and we have a couple of weeks to research this avenue.
A happy Possum is rare, but when she has those moments (and that is what they are) she is impossibly happy, wiggling with delight like a puppy.
I am off to look at your link THANK YOU!!!
That was the little girl dressing up for the costume contest with her Christy.
especially the first one:
http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_se ... order.html
Possum's CCD behaviour is just about a constant when she is moving at all, or moves from one spot to another, or one toy to another. Her aggression is a constant in these episodes.
She attacked Gabriel this morning, they slept snout to snout and she woke up and attacked him. I had bloodshed in the hallway this morning.
I locked her in the bathroom when I left the house this morning, as Christy was asleep when I left, and I cannot trust Possum at all with Gabriel. Gabriel will turn mean as a result of this constant battering and he is terrified of her. Even Ambrr will walk around the room to stay away from her.
My ulcers have kicked in high gear and I am so afraid.
No one is happy, including poor baby Possum, who does have such beautiful shining moments of joy.
I don't know nuthin' about dog seizures but knew that in human seizures (institutional residents), seizures could sometimes manifest as wild, crazy, attacking, nasty, biting, destructive,chair throwing, impossible to restriant with 3 adult men, behavior.
http://www.petplace.com/dogs/medical-ca ... page1.aspx
Edited to add: Did I mention window breaking, head bashing into wall, stronger than Hercules, destructive?
Last edited by Dianne on Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
i really wish i could think of something possitive; but that is essentially why i had to put my gsd down a few months ago. I will look thru my books and see if i can come up with anything helpful. do you think it could be a smell or sound prevoking this? do you think it could be plain territorial / pack leadership?
My friend, very knowledgable about dogs, believes that my dog was more pack issue than anything - and she is probably right. to work on that, you have to go to "nothing in life is free"
Which, if you can, might be a good idea for possum regardless of the cause.... if she is always on a leash attached to you , you can ward off these attacks. I am afraid that once an attack like this has happened, if the other dog has ANY signs of fear or submissiveness; her behavior is going to escalate. I know you know more about dog pack issues than i do, but if you think about this: Whatever prevoked the initial attack from her, now when she walks past a dog she had attacked, (s)he may shy away a little - leaving her the new found space to assert her dominance - she may snap a toy from in front of them. she might give them the look ( ok the low growl in your home where the look doesn't work) The more I go on, I am talking MYSELF into she should be "Nothing in life is free" just so she doesn't escalate from here. I think tis is a definate after being with multiple dogs and having one attack another.
Even with the cats, Zoey has gone after different ones intermittently.....sometimes he just walks by - minding his own business- and another cat will flinch and jump away and run like he is going to kill them - he , meanwhile, just ignores them or looks at them like he hasn't a clue why they are so jumpy.
However, cats tend to fight more with noise - dogs tend to not mess around.
onr of my links that no longer works was 'thyroid problem causing behavior" so I found a couple of these health problems that could contribute:
http://www.petplace.com/dogs/medical-ca ... page1.aspx
Well, it has been an excrutiating day.
The good news is, though, that Possum finally has an Rx. Doc Smith was out today. So Christy & Donna saw Doc Carol something. By happy coincidence, Doc Carol has 2 double dapple doxies, both of whom are deaf and both of whom have had enucleation of both eyeballs, so both are blind as well.
Doc Rx Chlomicalm, which is the brand for chlomipramine, the Rx of choice for CCD. She feels it will help in the aggression as well, and wants to see Possum again in 3 weeks before upping her dose. It is a drug that has to build in the system.
Did a lot of research in teh last 24 hours on top of months of research, and I am flat exhausted. Possum's news was the one shining spot in an otherwise really bad day.
Hurray. In 3 weeks, we should start seeing some small, very small improvements.
Week four. Not going well. Aggression has exploded, and doc not inclined to further ... um ...
Had to argue for a refill. And to get her in to up the dosage, which they are NOT inclined to do. Doc said "This is as good as it is going to get."
Seeking help from other sources. Not looking too good for the little lady.
Not seizures, as according to doc, seizures don't stop when you 'force' them, as the aggression does. Good point I hadn't thought of.
My heart goes out to you. This must be very difficult for you.
Are we talking rage fits of unknown origin?
Yes, yes and yes.
I was just reading about a new sleep aid (I have screaming insomnia) which is simply L-Trypophan. Found in turkey. An essential amino acid. L-T also increases seratonin.
So at the very least, I will be picking up a turkey breast and thighs today, to cook and add to her kibble. (and my own).
The RAGE article is very interesting and seems to fit her, although they call it extremely rare.
We thought we were on track a month ago. Not so good today. Tomorrow scares the daylights out of me. Gabriel is now fly biting, and my ulcers have kicked in bad. Possum scares me to death because of her attacks on Gabriel.
You can buy tryptophan in the health food store or Walgreen's. It's common and easy to find. I don't know anything about its use in dogs.
http://www.walgreens.com/search/search_ ... tryptophan
The quote Dianne found sounds hopeful. At least someone recognizes this condition and has treated it. I have heard of meds called serotonin reuptake inhibitors, Prozac is one but here is a list of others. I do not know about their use in dogs.
I hope something works for all your sakes. It isn't like you haven't tried and tried.
Melatonin is also beneficial for human sleep. GNC sells it.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/melato ... -melatonin
Last edited by Dianne on Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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