Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

For urgent matters only. Please post all other requests in the appropriate category. Do not post "Rescue Needed" or "Financial Aid Needed" here. They have their own forums (below).
Forum rules
If your pet has a medical emergency, please contact a veterinarian immediately.
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

Hallo,

On Fri.May.27, my 12-yr old Maine Coon boy started behaving very oddly. Over the course of a couple of days, he went from a bouncy know-it-all to a listless, apathetic shadow of his former self. He spends all day and night curled up in a ball. He isn't interested in food, which normally he wolfs down; he doesn't want to go outside, normally he can't wait. He seems quite happy in himself; purrs like anything when stroked.
He is perhaps drinking a bit more than normal, which made me think "kidneys". Otoh, he's not eating, so would probably drink more.

Euclid is not exhibiting any signs of distress. He's not vomiting; his eyes are bright; his coat looks slightly less shiny than normal but not much; he doesn't say "ouch" when various bits are prodded; his teeth and ears seem fine.

I took him to the Vet on Wed.Jun.01, who did a thorough physical; blood test; and X-rays. He said that he couldn't find anything out of the ordinary "for his age", and wanted to scan him. He did say that Euclid's breathing was "slightly rough", and that the lungs on the X-ray "could be a bit darker".
The vet is very young, I haven't met him before. He told me he had discussed the case with his older, more experienced boss while he was looking at the test results.
I said I would think about the scans, and would give Euclid a couple more days to see how things went. The vet gave me some Emeprid which he said would help with his appetite (it hasn't).

I don't know how to read the blood test results, in terms of what they could mean, so thought I would post them here. This forum has some very experienced people (which the Vet certainly isn't), and I'm praying that someone can find some clues in the test results. Euclid is losing weight very fast, and becoming weak as a result - he is already avoiding jumping, and is moving at a snail's pace.
Don't mind saying, I'm worried sick. I realise 12 yrs is starting to get on in age for an MC, but I expected a gradual winding down, not an abrupt change. Our 19 yr old "Heinz 57" cat left us in 2020, and he took ~18 months to gently exit.
I really hope someone can help. I'm not ready to say goodbye yet.

PS: I failed to get the .pdf file to 256 kb without compromising the legibility of the blood test results, so I've posted it here:
>> https://kestrel.ws/downloads/Euclid-blo ... .06.01.pdf
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
User avatar
CarolC
Moderator
Posts: 13698
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by CarolC »

Hi!
:welcomeback:
It's wonderful to see you, but I'm sorry it's an emergency. I downloaded your PDF and can hopefully get some of the answers on the results, but it may take a little while.

The thing I wanted to say right away, before even doing that, is that there is always a worry of hepatic lipidosis if a cat isn't eating. Dogs can usually go off their food for a few days and be OK, but in cats the liver does not metabolise body fat like a dog or a human and they can become very sick. I start to worry after 24 hours of no eating and I really worry by 48. If it was my cat, and he really isn't eating anything, I would take him straight in to the vet for a tube feeding immediately. It's a simple procedure that does not require anaesthesia, at least here it doesn't.

I am going to look up your results now, but it will take a little while. I'm sorry for any delay.

OUT OF RANGE
His kalium/potassium K+ is low. If I understand the German, the normal range is 3.5-5.8 and his is 3.
Here is some info about low potassium.
https://vcahospitals.com/know-your-pet/hypokalemia-or-low-potassium-levels-in-cats wrote: Mild to moderate hypokalemia is seen relatively frequently in sick cats, but does not usually cause significant clinical signs. However, if severe hypokalemia develops, it can cause profound and life-threatening clinical signs. The main effect of severe hypokalemia is generalized muscle weakness. Affected cats have difficulty in getting up and walking, and may appear almost "drunk" because of their weakness. A common and characteristic sign of the muscle weakness is the inability to raise their head into a normal position, so that the head is held down or the neck is bent. Hypokalemia can also cause marked depression and lack of appetite. Some cats with hypokalemia may become constipated. In many cases, the cat will have a poor-quality coat.
His erythrocytes (red blood cells) are low. That may be some kind of anemia but I don't know what causes it. Normal range is 6.54-12.2, and his are 6.09.

His leukocytes (white blood cells) are high. I think that may be some kind of infection, but again I don't know what causes it. Normal range says 2.87-17.02 and his are 23.88.

His neutrophils are high. Normal range says 2.3-10.29 and his are 19.1
I don't know anything about neutrophils, so here is an explanation I looked up.
https://justcatsclinic.com/lab-work-but-my-cat-isnt-sick-why-preventive-care-labs-matter/ wrote:Neutrophils help fight infections. They can be decreased with bone marrow disease, in some viral diseases, and in some cats receiving cancer chemotherapy drugs. Neutrophils are increased with inflammation or infection of any part of the body and in cats receiving prednisolone or other cortisone-type drugs.
His monocytes are high. Normal range says 0.05-0.67 and his are 1.07.
I don't know anything about monocytes, so here is an explantion I looked up.
https://felinecrf.org/diagnosis_cbc.htm#monocytes wrote:Monocytes may be elevated (monocytosis) when any condition that produces inflammation is present. However, they may also be high because of stress e.g. vet visits.
HIGH OR LOW NORMAL RANGE
His BUN is at the lowest end of the normal range. Normal range says 16-36, his is 17.
I don't know anything about BUN, but here is an explanation I looked up.
https://tbeah.com/blog/2018/07/17/understanding-blood-work-the-biochemical-profile-for-cats/ wrote: BUN stands for blood urea nitrogen and is the primary end product of protein metabolism. [skip] Low levels indicate liver disease or starvation.
His GGT is at the lowest end of the normal range.
I don't know anything about GGT, but here is an explanation I looked up.
https://tbeah.com/blog/2018/07/17/understanding-blood-work-the-biochemical-profile-for-cats/ wrote: GGT is also important in nitrogen metabolism and is found within liver cells. [skip] Low levels indicate starvation and malnutrition.
His albumin is at the low end of the normal range. Normal range says 2.3-3.0 and his is 2.4.
I don't know anything about albumin, but here is an explanation I looked up.
https://www.petmd.com/cat/conditions/endocrine/c_ct_hypoalbuminia wrote: Hypoalbuminemia is a condition in which the levels of albumin in the cat's blood serum are abnormally low. A protein formed in the liver and carried into the blood, albumin is responsible for regulating blood volume by controlling pressure in the blood compartment. It is also important for retaining fluid in the vascular compartment. TTherefore, a deficiency of albumin can pose grave risks for a cat, including dangerous fluid buildup.
His globulin is at the highest end of the normal range. Normal range is 2.8-5.1 and his is 5.1.
I don't know anything about globulin, but here is an explanation I looked up.
https://vcahospitals.com/know-your-pet/serum-protein-electrophoresis-general wrote: In most cases, a high total globulin level in the blood indicates underlying inflammation or infectious disease, but sometimes it indicates the presence of cancer, especially involving lymphoid cells.
C.
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

Bless your cotton socks, CarolC, and thank you.
It's great to see you too, wish it wasn't such an occasion.

I threw all my rules in the bin on Monday and bought an organic chicken and salmon (picky £$%&* won't eat supermarket chicken!). I've been hand-feeding him teeny bits (about half the size of the end joint of one's little finger) every few hours - he gets cross if it's more frequent. And syringing him with water. (I'll remember what you said about fatty liver and 48 hrs for the future.)

The little bits seem to go down fine, but if I put it on a plate in front of him he sniffs it a bit then walks away back to his rug. I've never seen anything like it.
By the way, he's not over-weight, rather on the light side if anything, at 7kg.

Thank you so much for looking at the blood test results. It's utterly Greek to me, meaning I can read the words, but the numbers mean nothing.
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
User avatar
CarolC
Moderator
Posts: 13698
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by CarolC »

OK, so glad you have been getting some food in him and he's not overweight. I've been looking up the readings and inserting them back into the first post. I will continue, but my impression (I am not a vet and have no medical training) is that he needs to be seen by a qualified vet for a second opinion immediately. I don't know what time it is there, but if you know an experienced vet, I would try to get in asap. Or the emergency vet if it is the weekend. Emergency vets are not specialists but they have a lot of experience. Surely they can do something for him besides an appetite stimulant.

EDIT TO ADD: I looked up all the results that were out of range and put them into the first post. That's all of them. It looks like an infection, possible anemia, and somewhat low potassium. I don't know why they didn't give him some kind of antibiotic, even if the vet wasn't sure of the source of the infection, but I'm not a vet. It wouldn't help if it's a viral infection. I also don't know how low his red cells have to be before they do a transfusion, but you could ask.

Please post back if you can get him in to another vet and what you find out.

:angel:
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

Hi,

I've been looking up the things you posted as you posted them, and trying to get a picture of what's going on.

Potassium, BUN, GGT levels could be attributed to not eating much.
Albumin: low level is a symptom of something else going on (malnutrition, infection, kidneys).
Globulin (contains antibodies): inflammation, infection, liver, kidney

I ended up making a spreadsheet to try to get a better visual picture.
Euclid-blood-test-analysis.pdf
(25.93 KiB) Downloaded 139 times
Overall, it looks to me like an inflammation / infection problem. But he doesn't have a temperature, which I would expect.

The vet I saw was the emergency vet, I couldn't get an appt at my usual vet's in a reasonable timeframe - they're very good, and therefore very popular.
I'm certainly not going back there again; I'm 600+ euro lighter, and I'm not impressed with the job he did.
If the results are all shouting "infection/inflammation", why on earth was he babbling on about scans, instead of antibiotics, for goodness' sakes? Honestly, I don't think he knew what he was looking at. When he gave me the test, he shrugged and said "There's a couple of things, but nothing to really worry about". I really don't agree!

I will send the bloodwork and X-rays to my usual vet by email, and hope he can squeeze me in asap, but it won't be before Monday. In the meantime, I will defrost some beef mince, and see if he'll eat that - he usually loves it.
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

... he wolfed it down, licked the plate clean, and begged for more.
Am I the victim of an elaborate con job??
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
User avatar
CarolC
Moderator
Posts: 13698
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by CarolC »

That's a good idea to send the results to your regular vet. Here the ER vets are supposed to do that automatically. I think vets make an effort to fit in urgent cases, especially for regular clients. Don't they have Saturday morning hours? Here if they don't have an appt open, they will fit you in by asking you to do a drop off, and whenever they have a minute between regular appts they will do the exam. One way to find out is to call them the minute they open. Ask them, "Didn't the ER send you the lab results?? He's been really sick. They didn't give him any antibiotics or anything." Advocate for him. You don't have to apologize, you've got test results to back you up!

That's great that he ate something. That is really great. I don't know what to make of it either.

That's totally not true that there's nothing to worry about, as the emergency vet claimed. I got an email from BendyMom who said the potassium and wbc are a huge concern. She suggested a urinalysis might be in order to see if that's where the infection is, and thought he might need IV antibiotics, potassium supplements, and who knows what else.

Your analysis pdf puts my cut-and-paste info to shame! :) Please post back how he does and what you find out. It's time to feed everybody and get to bed here...will be thinking of you.
User avatar
critters
Founding Member
Posts: 14360
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 7:00 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by critters »

You can also consider posting at VetPet https://www.facebook.com/groups/406222879912 . The FB group isn't as active as the email one was, but it doesn't cost anything to join. The vets are typically helpful, especially when they understand that you've already been to a (young, inexperienced) vet, or when a practice has changed. Regardless, though, I'm glad he's feeling better and starting to eat some!
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

Quick update: Euclid and I eventually folded around 6am. We got up late at ~1pm, he ate a tiny breakfast, and then asked to be let out - which is very different from what I've been seeing. I don't know if it's the result of some food last night, but he's definitely walking a bit more perkily, not the heavy-footed plod, plod I've been seeing. He spent the afternoon futzing on the terrace, and only just came in (it's 8pm here). He ate a tiny bit, morsels of chicken and beef, but not much; I gave him a syringe of water.

I'll defo be on the doorstep of my Vet on Mon 8am. Not sure there's much more I can do atm except keep on shoving more bits of meat down him when he'll take them. But at least he's taking something, be it ever so little.

I really appreciate the moral support and hand-holding, especially re deciphering that wretched blood test. Honestly didn't know where to start with it until you paved the way :(
The spreadsheet was just an attempt at filtering out the vast qty of words, to bare-bones essential info. Embarrassed to admit I'd no idea even that white blood cells are called Leukocytes.... argh, the depth of my ignorance knows no bounds.

@critters: Thanks, I will defo do that this pm. I can borrow my nephew's Fb a/c to do it, as my "religious principles" forbid me from having one myself :)
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
User avatar
CarolC
Moderator
Posts: 13698
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by CarolC »

maine_coonz wrote: Sat Jun 04, 2022 1:26 pm The spreadsheet was just an attempt at filtering out the vast qty of words, to bare-bones essential info. Embarrassed to admit I'd no idea even that white blood cells are called Leukocytes
That makes two of us. I kind of guessed Leukozyten was Leukocytes by sounding it out, but that didn't mean I knew what they were. :oops: Fortunately it had (WBC) in parentheses, and even that might have been a stumper, but I had seen RBC was at the top of the list, and I knew that one (yay!). A month from now I plan to have forgotten again. :roll:

Kalium (K+) is Greek to me, no wait, it's German, same difference. But I remembered from 8th grade that KNO3 was the formula for potassium nitrate, so there was another clue. I thought I was going to have to Google Translate the whole list. Thank goodness for all the parentheses.

Sorry it was so wordy. It definitely was! :haha:

That's great that he's acting like he's feeling a little bit better. If it's a virus or an infection, maybe he's fighting it off? I would love to know what this is/was. If you weren't nursing him when he crashed, I'm not sure how it would have turned out. Hepatic lipidosis and dehydration are both serious.

I don't know how true it is, but I read once that it isn't really do-able to get enough fluids into a cat via syringing water, even though that's the advice they always give. You might want to watch for any symptoms of dehydration. Here are a couple of methods for checking. I like the tent method. You pull up the skin on the back of the neck/shoulders. It should snap right back smoothly. If it stays loose and does not smooth back out right away, that's a sign. I used to check Piper all the time. I started calling it "tenty" if her skin stayed tented up and didn't snap back. I'd say "You're pretty tenty right now". Then she would need fluids. Giving sub-Q fluids is a more effective way to be sure you're getting enough into them. That's something you can do at home. I got brave enough to learn to do it from knowing other people here who do it for their cats and hearing from them how much it helps.
https://felinecrf.org/symptoms_regulation_body_fluid.htm wrote: You should regularly check your cat's hydration levels: the most common method is to pinch the skin, usually at the scruff of the neck - the skin should fall back into place immediately. Most CKD cats experience some degree of dehydration so the skin may not fall back as quickly as in a healthy cat, but if it takes a few seconds you should look into improving your cat's hydration.

Another way to check is to feel your cat's gums: they should look shiny and feel slick. If they feel sticky, your cat is probably dehydrated.
User avatar
critters
Founding Member
Posts: 14360
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 7:00 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by critters »

Yeah, "medicalese" is a language of its own, never mind the German problem!
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

I've spent the last week alternating between saying "goodbye" n million times, only to oscillate to "yay! you're gonna be okay!"... and then back again. I took him to my usual Vet, only to be told pretty much the same thing: dunno, maybe onset of kidney disease.... old cat... mumble...
He wanted to keep Euclid in for a couple of days under observation, ye gods I'm not made of money! And also there's nothing he could've done that I can't, re keeping him hydrated and fed.

I've been feeding him via a huge syringe, ditto re water. Fortunately he's a very good-natured boy, doesn't like it much, but kindof accepts it. I couldn't get much into him at any one time, but at least it was something. Towards the end of the week, he gradually started eating on his own, not a lot, but asking for it, and munching with every sign of enjoyment.
He has lost a great deal of weight - but then every summer his food intake goes right down, he sheds his winter coat, and turns into a skinny. (Come October, he starts eating like a horse, and fluffs out.) But he's defo a lot thinner than I'm happy with.

However, onto the "good" news. We were lying in bed on Fri night, with my mind turning over and over trying to think what could be going on. Then I thought "Hm. I wonder." I took him back to the Vets on Sat am, and insisted they test for Covid. Whaddyaknow, he's positive.

When the Vet phoned with the results, he agreed that Euclid's symptoms and blood test results tied in with him having Covid. I suggested he halve his bill as *I* was the one who figured it out, but he didn't go for that - which I have a huge problem with.

But right now, who cares - he's slowly getting back to his annoying, bouncy self - this morning at dawn (4:30am) he was irritatingly dragging his claws through my hair; when I hit him with a pillow, he went downstairs and banged on the door wanting to be let out. Never thought hearing that racket would make me smile :)
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

PS: Thanks for the info re testing for hydration. The pinching the scruff thing is super-easy to do, very good to know, appreciated.
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
User avatar
CarolC
Moderator
Posts: 13698
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:00 pm
Contact:

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by CarolC »

OMG!!! I thought of that, too, when the one vet mentioned dark lungs on the x-ray and it reminded me of the ground glass opacity in Covid patients, but when I checked the symptoms online I didn't think they matched. That is great! I've been worried about how you guys were doing, and didn't want to ask. It is clear if you hadn't been nursing him like this, he would have had a much harder time, which I guess is a warning for anyone with a Covid cat. I didn't know it was that bad. How do you think he was exposed?

Yeah, the scruff thing is easier than checking gums. Not sure how it applies during sudden weight loss. There can be a hollow eyed look in the face, too. You get to know it. That might help confirm.
maine_coonz
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Cat won't eat, listless, but Vet can't find anything wrong; blood?

Post by maine_coonz »

I did a lot of trawling re Covid symptoms in cats. Just like in people, they can present completely differently.

For eg, I had no temperature, no stomach upsets, only an annoying cough when I tried to speak - but not at any other time. And I had zero strength, had to rest halfway up the garden to the compost bin (about 30 strides). But no other symptoms at all.
So Euclid had no temperature, no sniffles, no tummy upset, no watery eyes, etc. Just zero appetite, zero energy, complete listlessness.
Erasmus (Raz) + Euclid + Heimdall,
Living in Germany
Post Reply