My dog slipped a disc today.

[ssg]

I'm so glad I found this discussion board. I am currently in crisis. My beloved 8 year old german shepherd suddenly went weak in the rear end two nights ago and yesterday was unable to walk. Our vet suspects a disc injury, and has recommended we either spend ~$5000 on spinal surgery or euthanize him. I am just heartbroken about it. He has sensation in his legs and genital area, but can only move his legs minimally.

I came across this website featuring the dog carts, and am trying to decide if this is the best way to go. We can't afford surgery, and even if we could, I don't think he could withstand the surgery on account of his significant heart murmer.

I have concerns about the quality of life issue, and whether or not he will have ongoing pain with a disc that has not been operated on. I'd rather put him down than to put him through pain, just because I want him to continue living.

It's been over 24 hours, and he hasn't urinated or passed any fecal material. When I stimulate his anus, he has, what I believe to be normal sensation there, so I'm thinking he'll just go when he needs to. When I press on where I think his bladder is, I can't feel anything bulging, so I'm not certain if he's just not full or I'm missing it. I pushed in on both sides just above his penis, but nothing comes out.

Have any of your animals spontaneously ruptured a disc? Am I to assume he was injured somehow? If this is always true, then all I can think of is that perhaps our 10 month old german shepherd puppy, all 70 pounds of her, pounced on his back in play.

How many of you have had successful surgery done on your dogs and have them completely regain their range of motion? Is it always a limited return, or do some completely return to their normal activity levels?

Oh, I am so overwhelmed my head is spinning. Thank you for listening. And thank you in advance for your help. I truly need it.

Sandy

[CarolC]

Hi Sandy,

Others will be along shortly to tell you their experience with disk injuries. Here are some basics:

Disks sometimes repair themselves through rest

If you cannot afford surgery (which is not guaranteed to work) you can try crate rest, usually with steroids. Sometimes the disk will repair itself with absolutely strict rest. If you cannot do surgery, I would certainly try him on 6-8 weeks of crate rest. He may recover. I would not consider putting a dog down with deep pain sensation.

Constipation is not a problem

Do not worry about him not defecating, he can go 4-5 days without defecating before you should worry.

Bladder is a priority

If he has not urinated, he needs to. If you cannot feel anything, probably it is because he is a big dog and you are not used to feeling for his bladder. There is a chance he is not urinating because he is holding it because he is in the house in his bed. There is a good chance he has simply lost the ability for now while his back is acting up. Bladder care is a must. He needs to be taken to someone who can either express his bladder or catheterize him. Due to his size, I would go with catheterizing--no lifting. You can learn to express or catheterize at home (many of us do that here), but right now he needs to be seen and they can train you. If you notice him urinating, it will probably be from bladder overflow, not because he went on purpose.

Cart and quality of life

A cart is a great idea but it is too soon to know if he will need one. The cart company I dealt with did not recommend putting a dog in their cart until 6 weeks post injury to allow the back to heal. He may need pain relief for a while but probably not long term. We can give you so many stories of paralyzed dogs and the happy lives they lead.

Here is information on bladder care:

short version:
http://www.handicappedpets.com/Articles/express

detailed version:
http://www.handicappedpets.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=Express_a_dog_or_cat

Here is information on crate rest:
http://www.dodgerslist.com/lit/After_Surgery.htm

Yes, you should be totally stressed out right now, that is normal. It gets better. Crate rest is easy to do and doesn't cost a thing. Catheterizing will be easy, too (or expressing if you are fit enough for a large dog). Glad you are here!

[slipmonki]

Have any of your animals spontaneously ruptured a disc? Am I to assume he was injured somehow? If this is always true, then all I can think of is that perhaps our 10 month old german shepherd puppy, all 70 pounds of her, pounced on his back in play.

My mini dachshund spontaneously ruptured two discs last month. I didn't know it at the time, but she ruptured one spontaneously about 2-3 years ago. That one healed itself.

I say "spontaneously" because she didn't fall, nothing fell on her, etc. But I HAVE been bad about letting her jump on and off furniture, which is a big no no. I've tried repeatdly to get her to stop, but she's as dumb as a box of hair (and all the more loveable for it) and impossible to keep down. The vet blamed years of that plus genetics for her slipped discs.

[ssg]

I just came back from the after hours urgent care. We couldn't express his bladder and the vet wouldn't send a catheter home with me, saying it was a liability! This vet also told me to euthanize him, because he would not have any quality of life. I'm just heartsick. If only I had the money...I can't stand the thought of having to kill him because I can't afford the treatment. It's just not fair. I just don't know what to do.

Sandy

[Mary and Roxy]

Hi Sandy
Roxy had the disk prob. vet said surgery or but her down, I couldnt afford it, I found this site and with the help of these wonderful people shes walking, running, and jumping again.

One day she started walking kinda hunched over like she had been kicked in the butt by the end of the day she couldnt use her back legs at all.Vet gave us some steroids . and basically sent me home. I tryed and tryed to express her and make her poop, but nothing worked, then it hit me maybe she was still controling that,I did as i was advised here, crate rest at least 6 weeks, she made no improvment for 5 weeks then all the sudden she slowely got better. i bought a walkablout sling to help her with the potty trips and that was heaven sent. Theres no need to put her down, give the crate rest a try. follow the directions your told here and ill bet youll be going down to show your vet how wrong he was, Like i got to do, he couldnt believe it he now comes to this site to learn a few things
Best of luck. well add you to our prayers, Mary

[slipmonki]

Get another vet. Make it clear that while you might not have the money to exercise all medical options, you have the will to do whatever you can on your own. My dog went down a month ago, so I'm new to all of this too. I came to this place thinking my dog was going to die and that there was nothing I could do about it. Spend a few hours poking around this website and this forum, and your feelings of utter helplessness should subside.

I never had a vet specifically tell me to euthanize Lady, but it was presented to me as an option. I accredit this to my vet being a good one, as well as one I knew on a personal level (I worked for him for 5 years). On the ride home from her bad and unpromising diagnosis, I cried like crazy while she sat in the passenger seat giving me the most soulful little stare I have ever seen from her. It may sound kooky, but I literally heard her beg me to not be upset and to not give up on her. I promised her then and there I would do everything within my power to help her and that I wouldn't let her go until she was in pain and unhappy and told me to let her go. YOU will know if your dog is in pain or unhappy, no one else will.

My dog still isn't walking and is incontinent, but she is SO HAPPY. People are skeptical of that until they see her. Even the neurologist, after having her for 3 days, commented on how happy and high spirited she was through the whole ordeal. Even with no recovery, a dog can be happy in this condition if they're cared for properly. Find a vet that will work with you and udnerstand you, and go from there.

[Christine]

Thank goodness, you are here. Just listen to those who have had your same problem and definitely get another vet. Just over a month ago, a vet told me to put Bailey down and thanks to this board, the support and information, I knew it was not time and I knew to try one more thing. You will know when and if that needs to be done - not someone who assumes they know what is best for you and your dog because they have run out of options that don't cost a fortune.

Just keep asking questions, we are all here for you.

Love,

[Dianne]

Good Morning Sandy,

You've come to the right place. So many of us have been through the heartbreaking few days/weeks of a pet injury, a vet who is unsupportive, and lack of information how to deal with the injury.

CarolC has given you good links so that you CAN care for your pup. Start reading. The BIG factor is bladder care. You MUST catherize or express the bladder to keep your dog free of a urinary tract infection TODAY.

BethT and others should be along shortly to discuss how they catherize their dogs. A vet should work WITH you and NOT against you. If you are willing to care for your dog (catherize), then you should be instructed how to do it.

IMMEDIATELY start crate rest.

Next, find a way to empty the bladder. If you need a new vet ( I think you do), then find one who will teach you how to catherize, or express. If your pup needs pain meds, get them from this vet. It's the weekend, and you may have to go to an emergency vet to express/catherize if no one will see you today.

You might call several vet offices and try phone interviewing the office staff.

(1) Does this vet care for any paralyzed animals (long or short term paralysis) or does he recommend euthanasia?

(2) Can someone teach me how to catherize or express my dog TODAY?

(3) Will the vet work WITH me during my dog's paralysis, even if I cannot afford the surgery?

Almost everyone reading this section of the bb has been through this terrible ordeal. We've all cried...sometimes a lot!

The fact that your dog has some sensation in his rear is very good. He may recover with 4 to 6 weeks of rest. You do NOT have to euthanize a paralyzed pet. Make sure you tell the NEW vet that YOU ARE WILLING TO CARE FOR THIS PET!

Dianne

[ssg]

You've given me so much to think about, yet I'm still in such a quandry. Am I doing enough? Should I have the diagnostic tests to tell me exactly what he has?

My husband is calling the vet today to request a neurosurgeon referral. I'm guessing they will want to do an MRI. I am concerned that all this in and out of the car is going to further damage him.

The vet told me last night that all he has left is deep pain sensation. Two evenings ago he still had reflexes, but now he does not. He cries all the time unless I'm next to him to hold him. I don't know if he's in pain, or just upset that he can't do all the things he normally used to do.

My husband is going to see if the neurosurgeon will allow us to use a catheter at home until we decide what needs to be done. If not, we'll be seeking another vet.

This is tearing me apart. I feel such a profound sadness in my heart.
Sandy

[BethT]

Sandy, I have a dog named Waffles that ruptured his disk over 2 years ago. He went into the surgery within 24 hours of losing deep pain and he came out of surgery still with no deep pain. He never regained his ability to walk. The surgery does not always work. He uses a cart and I have to express his bladder. I want you to know that I was also told he would have no quality of life and should consider putting him down (most of us have been told that). Waffles is the poster child for cart dogs. He is the happiest dog that you would every meet and really doesn't seem to know that he has a handicap. Waffles is not a little dog. He is a Doberman/Pitbull mix and weighs 55 lbs.

Listen to what you have been reading on the site. Crate rest and prednisone like eveyone has been telling you. I would find a vet that is willing to work with you. I express Waffles bladder now but for the first year I was cathetering him. That was my vets idea because she knew it would take time for me to learn how to express him. It really relieved a lot of the stress in the beginning. Cathetering is not hard at all with male dogs. It is a little scarey at first but once you get over the fear factor it is quite easy. There is no reason that a vet can't teach you how to catheter.

The fact that your dog still has deep pain is very good. There is hope and even if he never walks again I can tell you that I have never regretted my decision to take care of a handicapped dog. We are here to help you anyway we can. Beth

[CarolC]

My husband is calling the vet today to request a neurosurgeon referral. I'm guessing they will want to do an MRI. I am concerned that all this in and out of the car is going to further damage him.

If possible, have your husband carry him to the car and lay him on the seat. When you arrive at the hospital, they should send out 2 vet techs with a gurney and lift him out of the car and put him on the gurney. I see this done all the time with big dogs who can't walk at the hospital my dog goes to for PT. This is one time when it helps to have a station wagon or SUV.

A myelogram is also considered diagnostic for disk problems and is likely to cost less. It is a common procedure with a slight risk, you could discuss it with the vet. Many places do not have MRIs but do myelograms.

The vet told me last night that all he has left is deep pain sensation. Two evenings ago he still had reflexes, but now he does not.

So you don't know if his disk is flaring up more, or if something else is going on. If it is a possible disk problem, many vets would put your dog on prednisone (steroid) to help the inflammation go down around the disk, like Mary mentioned. My golden retriever went down with a bad back after falling on his bottom getting in the car and then falling on his bottom again getting into the La-Z-Boy, and he was put on crate rest and steroids. I don't know why you haven't been offered this simple option.

It is rough that this happens on the weekend. I am not sure where you are. If you are in a fair sized city, there is probably more than one emergency vet and you may have better luck with another location. Also, if you go back to the same emergency vet, they may have a different vet on duty who would be more helpful. Twice I have had a really sick pet and gone to the emergency vet and paid for a consult where I just talked to the vet to see if it was worth putting my pet in the car and bringing him to the vet. You might consider doing that. It will only be the cost of the appointment, not an exam or meds, and if you are lucky they will apply that cost to the bill when you take him in and not charge you for 2 appointments.

He cries all the time unless I'm next to him to hold him. I don't know if he's in pain, or just upset that he can't do all the things he normally used to do.

When was the last time you strained your back? Remember how it felt? Many dogs are put on pain meds for a while after they strain their back. If your vet suspects a disk problem, this is something else s/he should offer you, or you could ask about it.

My husband is going to see if the neurosurgeon will allow us to use a catheter at home until we decide what needs to be done. If not, we'll be seeking another vet.

Good for you! Even without a myelogram or an MRI, if your vet suspects a disk injury, you should be instructed to rest the dog, and given options of steroids and pain meds. You should also be shown how to do bladder care. Murphy's family could not express him either, and the vet showed them how to catheterize, just as Beth's vet did for Waffles.

I just came back from the after hours urgent care. We couldn't express his bladder and the vet wouldn't send a catheter home with me, saying it was a liability!

If that vet could not express his bladder, did he then catheterize him??? Or did he just do nothing after he failed to express? If your dog hasn't had his bladder emptied in over 24 hours, I don't blame him for whining. And if that vet didn't catheterize him, shame on him!

Please update on what is going on, and I hope you will have some progress soon. If by any chance your dog starts to develop weakness in front or shows signs of trouble breathing, then I recommend taking him to the vet right away. Will be waiting to hear how it goes.

[ssg]

I just spoke with the first vet, who told me that there is no way to cath a dog at home sterilly, and that I will have to have to buy sterile kits to use each time. He said the same thing the overnight vet said; that he needs to stay in the urgent care to be catheterized, and that home catheterization is a liability.

The vet has called a specialty urgent care and arranged for my baby to be seen there. I still don't know if I can do this financially. No credit on any of my cards, and no savings whatsoever ( I put another dog with cancer down several months ago after $4000 of diagnostics, etc).

So, now I'm faced with the inability to bankroll a surgery if they believe he will have benefit from it. The clock is ticking, and if I don't get in him in for surgery soon, the deep pain sensations will be gone, and there's no turning back.

My husband has just called me to say my son broke his hand this morning playing soccer. Can anything else happen that hasn't gone wrong yet?

I will make certain the techs use a stretcher upon arrival. It's getting him into my SUV at home all by myself that's going to be a struggle. My back is already killing me from toweling up his rear to reposition him, etc.

Sandy

[CarolC]

I just spoke with the first vet, who told me that there is no way to cath a dog at home sterilly, and that I will have to have to buy sterile kits to use each time. He said the same thing the overnight vet said; that he needs to stay in the urgent care to be catheterized, and that home catheterization is a liability.

That's silly. BethT catheterized Waffles for a year.

http://handicappedpets.com/help/viewtop ... 739&t=5775

Karen catheterized Bully (100-lb dog if I remember) -- the above message is in a thread about Bully being catheterized.

Murphy's Dad catheterized Murphy because they couldn't express him. See the second message in this thread:

http://www.handicappedpets.com/help/vie ... urphy#8285

Others on this board have done it.

My husband has just called me to say my son broke his hand this morning playing soccer. Can anything else happen that hasn't gone wrong yet?

Oh, boy. Hope he's OK.

I will make certain the techs use a stretcher upon arrival. It's getting him into my SUV at home all by myself that's going to be a struggle. My back is already killing me from toweling up his rear to reposition him, etc.

When my golden retriever couldn't walk, I had to get the 2 guys from next door to put him in the car for me. Get someone to help you and bake them some brownies. Do NOT hurt yourself--if you do it changes all your plans for caring for him.

Here is a link showing how to turn a german shepherd.

http://www.mzjf.com/turn-dog.htm

Oh, Sandy, hang in there. It does get better! Better days are coming. You have about 3 problems going on, but if you can just get the bladder care thing sorted out, you can do crate rest for free and give him time to see if his disk will improve. Good luck with the vet!!!!!!!

P.S. Care Credit does loans for vet care with good terms. Many vet hospitals take it. You find out if you are approved right away.

http://www.carecredit.com

[karkorny]

Sandy, it's been awhile since I've been on this forum - because my dog is doing so well. And in your posts you sound much like I did when the crisis seemed more than I could bear. My 100-pound-plus bullmastiff was totally paralyzed from a stroke to the cervical spine. No husband, no kids, just me and my 83-year-old mom. I did, fortunately, have an available empty credit card - which now has a balance of over $10,000. But there were moments I felt I couldn't rise to the occasion. Bully had to be catheterized for several weeks and it was such a challenge, but I did it (with help from many on this forum). The vet who did surgery on his perforated ulcer - yes, that was about 10 days after the stroke! - instructed me on how to catheterize and said I had to do it. I did have a vet read me the riot act about it when I took him in for his emergency colitis, bleeding from the rectum - that was about 3 weeks after his stroke. He was angry about it, but he wasn't the one with this sick dog. We do what we have to do. FOrtunately, Bully did eventually start peeing on his own. When I originally tried expressing his bladder, finding it was a problem for me because of his size, but I do think I was looking in the wrong place. One vet told me to feel for his last rib and then move up just a little, and sure enough, I found it. I was pressing way too low, I'm sure. But it was easier for me to catheterize him during that period. Anyway, Sandy, I feel your pain. I went through several weeks of heart-wrenching agony over my dog, who is 8 years old, by the way. The good part is that it got better. Where originally I was having to get this big dog out into the yard several times a day, on and off a wagon I had a friend build, now he can hobble out there himself. When I look at his beautiful face, I know that every dime I spent, every tear I cried, every pulled muscle in my own back I suffered - everything was worth it. He's up on all fours, he has a quality of life back, and I'm so happy about it. Please hang in there. You can catheterize him yourself. It's hard, it may not be as sterile as they'd like it to be, but you can do it. And hopefully, soon he'll pee on his own. Sometimes they just think it's wrong to pee if they're not in their usual stance. By the way, there are so many people willing to help. I ran and ad in our local paper here, and also put signs up in coffee shops, etc, asking for help with handling a large paralyzed dog. You would not believe the response I got. People were calling asking to help - not for money either! If you need help, call the local vet offices. Some kind folks may be willing to come over and help you catheterize. Please don't give up!! Karen

[Matthew]

I can not offer you any medical help,as I am not qualified or experienced to do so,but what I can say is that I can relate to your feelings of desperation.
My dog Tommy is with a specialist and is currently under treatment.
This forum is the best place you can be at the moment,as many of the members here have been through what you are feeling now,the support I have received has been brilliant.Not only that you have a fantastic resource of information for your problems.
I wish you all the luck with your baby,and hope that all goes well for you all.
All my love ,Matthew.