UTI and FLUTD Symptoms

[CaliCatsMom]

Has anybody had experience with UTI or FLUTD that involved blood clots? My girl passes blood clots the size of a nickle a day or so after having blood in her urine. I am going back and forth with the vet about whether her symptoms are UTI/FLUTD or spay complications.

July 2013 my girl fell, dislocated her spine and injured her ovaries. The spinal injury left her bladder and fecal incontinent and they spayed her to remove her damaged reproductive system. 7 weeks after the spay, she started getting blood in her urine. She has these episodes every 2-4 months. An ultrasound done a year ago showed activity at the spay site and she has had 2 urine samples clear when she has had symptoms. At first the vet suspected spay complications but has backtracked with a diagnosis of FLUTD with idopatic cystitis. That is the breakdown of the bladder wall, allowing blood through, while there is no infection at the onset. If I do not treat her with antibiotics, she does develop fever and lethargy over a period of several weeks.

Her spine and incontinence are recovering. But the bloody urine is getting scarey. These last two times it has looked more like blood than urine. And she passes these big blood clots. I have gotten the vet to agree to endoscopy but it is not easy to get scheduled when she is symptomatic.

I am worried about putting my girl through more procedures when she is sick. Am I wrong not to just accept this as chronic cystitis?

[CarolC]

I have never seen anyone post about a problem like this. It seems like it is probably not (?) incontinence related or someone would have posted before now...

I wonder about trying an ultrasound just on the remote chance it might show something. They don't have to be sedated for that.

Could you perhaps get a referral to a specialist? I'd do that if you can afford it.

I hope you will post whatever you find out. This does not sound at all familiar, and there have been a lot of people here with paralyzed and incontinent pets.

[critters]

I agree--I've never heard of clots, even little ones, before. Peeing Kool Aid is pretty typical for a UTI, but I don't like the sound of those clots. Do you have a cat specialist vet within travel distance?

[CaliCatsMom]

Right now the plan her Vet and I have is to try to get her in for an endoscopy the next time it happens. The Vet that does the endoscopy is the same as did the ultrasound a year ago. He thinks we should repeat the ultrasound. But a year ago it indicated the problem was with her spay and we did not do surgery on that basis, so how conclusive is that? The endoscopy would be definitive. When Feline Idiopathic Cystitis (FIC) occurs, the bladder wall has a distinct appearance. He says he can check the bladder and the spay with the endoscope. That could also assist with information about how to do any corrective surgery if it is required. If it is FIC, I will get to pay a big bill. If it is complications with the spay, I will hopefully get a discount. I feel I need this information to know how to take care of my girl.

Interestingly, FIC occurs much more frequently in neutered males and females. One could suppose that the spay and her incontinence brought on the condition. But the blood clots and now the amount of blood in the urine has me alarmed.

I have her on a good diet to prevent infection and support nerve regeneration. Considering it from the inflammation perspective, the only thing she has been on are some GNC Hairball Treats that I give her to keep her stool soft, that contain Brewers Yeast. Her fecal and bladder incontinence have improved since her injury and I am taking her off the treats to see if that mitigates her problems. Brewers Yeast is thought to be an inflammatory in the case of the human version of the problem.

We will see. I sure hope to avoid the scope.

[michelleGDLCF]

Yes, I just went through this with my cat this past year. He was passing rather large, scary clots. Just a very bad UTI.

Can I ask what diet you have her on? I am struggling with ongoing UTI's and would love some ideas on what to do differently.

[CaliCatsMom]

IT WAS THE BREWERS YEAST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I finally found out what was giving my girl problems with blood in her urine. I had been giving her two products from GNC with Brewers Yeast in them. I feel so stupid. When she dislocated her back and developed bladder and fecal incontinence, I gave her vitamins and hair ball remedy that contained brewers yeast. I discontinued the vitamins but kept her on the hairball treats to help her with her fecal incontinence (at the vet's suggetion).

Well her incontinence has improved and she has not needed them. She was on the vitamins when she first developed blood in her urine.

She went from March to October of last year with fewer problems and then had a bad problem in October. I started researching Feline idiopathic Cystitis and only found out that this exists and they do not know what it is from. Then I found out that it is believed to be related to the same thing in Human females. For humans they recommend that you avoid beer and brewers yeast. So when she had her bad bad attack in December I took her off them in the remote chance that it was the problem. Two weeks later I had to take her to the vet because she had stopped eating. The vet express urine and alot of biological material that was unlike anything we had seem before (this may have been biofilms?). Since then she has been so much better. Her funky smell is gone and she is friskey.

There are alot of pet products, including supplements for "bladder health" that contain brewers yeast. BEWARE!!! They talk about alergies but I think they are referring to skin allergies and itching. This was her bladder!

[CaliCatsMom]

michelleGDLCF,

To answer your question: Cali was an orphaned, orphaned cat and I was low on funds so most of her life I gave her Friskeys Dried food. When I was doing a little better I fed her some of the canned stuff but she loved that dry food. She got a little fat and developed arthritics before her accident so I limited her dried food and got her weight down. She never had UTI until after her accident and being spayed.

There is a profile for cats with FIC, including dried food consumption and being spayed.

Now I give her some Friskeys canned turkey, special diet to get her to eat her supplements. But mostly I feed her Soulicious brand, the Shrimply Divine and Aromatic Chicken because it has the highest protein/calorie and my girl has a weight problem. The supplements I give her are D-manose, 1/8 tsp, 2X to protect her bladder. Then I give her Liquid Health's Joint Perrfection (glucosimine/chondroitin/MSM/HA) for arthritis and nerve damage. It is also supposed to be good for the bladder lining. She also gets Cat Mix Vitamins from Life Extensions (high in folic acid). I also give her a fish oil supplement for her nerve damage and pain relief.

At one point I was giving her the GNC vitamins with the brewers yeast and I was also giving her the hairball remedy treats that contained brewers yeast to prevent constipation with her fecal incontinence. THAT was a problem. Since I cut that out I have been giving her Soulicious food containing pumpkin.

[CaliCatsMom]

There is more to the story. Cali cat had another episode. This one was mild so I hope I am on the right track. Her odor is definitely gone and she has been an active, happy cat up to about a week ago. Then her incontinence got a little worse, she was not so active and there was blood in her urine. That lasted about half a day and then she passed some blood clots. The doctor recommended amitryptolyn (SP?).

Upon further investigation, I found her Friskeys Special Diet canned food had Brewers Rice in it. WTF? The regular formulation says rice. When I called Friskeys, they told me it was the grade. WTF? They specify grade on the lable????? *&%$$%^)P##@!!!! Liars, digging a little deeper I find that this can also be the rice waste product from after it has been through the brewery.

Definition: Brewer's Rice: The dried extracted residue of rice resulting from the manufacture of wort (liquid portion of malted grain) or beer and may contain pulverized dried spent hops in an amount not to exceed 3 percent.

It seems like Brewers yeast and the likes is in a whole lot of cat foods, including those formulated for urinary tract problems. The research I have reviewed indicates this problem in cats is related to the human cystitis and Brewers Yeast and Beer are big No!Nos!

BEWARE!!!!!!!

[critters]

Amitriptyline is an antidepressant and may be used in critters as a sedative or possibly for behavior modification. I can't imagine why they're using it for a UTI?? http://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-8611/ ... al/details

Here's a vet link. http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Conten ... &A=586&S=0

[CaliCatsMom]

My girl has relapsed and been passing bloody clots off and on for 11 days now. The amitriptyline seem to help her with her pain, but it it really reduces inflammation, I do not know. My cat always fit the profile of a FIC cat (inside, litter box, overweight, noise sensitive, shy, dried food). As she never had an inclination to go outside, I never had her spayed. This, however, is a major factor in FIC. She never had FIC until after she was spayed.

The thing is that her case was complex because she was spayed as a result of an injury to her reproductive system that occurred when she fell and also dislocated her back, causing fecal and bladder incontinence, etc. At first I thought it was a bad spay because an ultrasound showed the bladder good and activity at her spay site. That was 21 months ago. Her back injury and nerve damage have been healing.

I have changed her diet as well as I can figure. Before her accident, I had reduced her dried food to 1/3 of her diet because she had developed arthritis in her hips. After her accident I weened her off the last of her dried food and got a cat feeder with a chill pack in it to leave her food during the day. I have also been switching her off her Friskeys on to a better Soulicious brand. I made a mistake giving her GNC vitamins and Hairball Remedy (to help with her fecal incontinence) that had brewers yeast in it. I made a mistake and put her on the Friskeys Special (Urinary Tract) Diet Formulation with Brewers Rice in it. Friskeys has been fired. I have a couple of cans of the regular formulation as backup if I cannot get her to eat anything else.

I may also start her on her Orbax as past occurrence shows she will eventually develop infection. Poor thing. The clots she passes sometimes look more like mucus than blood, but it is some mixture of both. In between, she does not seem to have blood in her urine. Maybe this is her healing process.

[critters]

I have to say that that's all new to me. Have you tried getting her to drink more, like by putting broth into her water? I've also been known to mix some water into canned food.

[CarolC]

sub-Q fluids would also up the fluid intake and help flush her bladder

[CaliCatsMom]

I'm not sure how much more water would help. She seems to have plenty of wee and I get her to drink more of it when she does not eat so well. But I am disgusted with the lack of research on this, both in humans (women) and in cats. I guess they make more money treating it than curing it.

Here are some good links I found on it:
http://www.icatcare.org:8080/advice/cat ... stitis-fic
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/he ... -cats.aspx
http://homevetsnyc.com/feline-idiopathi ... -and-cure/

My vet is not much help at this point. Just prescribes the Amitriptyline and Orbax. I have had her on Orbax 4 days now and she is doing much better. They do not promote it as an anti-infamitory, but it seems to do the trick for my girl better than the Amitriptyline.

I am still quite certain the brewers yeast was a problem and we will see if she does better taking the Brewers Rice out of her diet. Unfortunatley, they say the problem is seasonal, so I might not know until next fall if it really works.

One other thing I am going to do is check out a new test they have out for food allergies. Typically, they relate to the skin but I have challenged the company who is out with this test. They say they do not know and I can find no specific studies about it. There are alot of references in the human and pet information on it that imply this is a significant factor. This is the test: http://www.nutriscan.org

It is a little expensive, so I am reluctant, but I have already paid alot of vet bills to keep my little cat with me. I just cannot stand to see her suffering. I have always loved animals, particularly cats and this one has been so devoted to me. I never realized how important she was to me until I almost lost her.

[CaliCatsMom]

Just an update on another discovery. Calicat got constipated after taking her off the GNC Hairball Remedy treats and her Friskeys. So there was another trip to the vet for an enema. Poor girl! When she dislocated her back she had nerve damage that caused her both fecal and bladder incontinence. Both functions are greatly improved, but still poor.

The GNC product had Brewers Yeast and Psyllium in it. So I tried giving her just the psyllium. The vet said 1/8 tsp, twice daily. Thank goodness I started her with just a pinch (1/64 tsp). Three doses and that awful smell was back. So we stopped that right away. I had thought for sure the Brewers Yeast was inflaming her bladder and giving her that bad smell. I still think that BY is bad news for bladders (inflammatory). But now I have to put psyllium on the list with the BY and the Brewers Rice.

To be truthful, I do not know if the bad smell is directly causes to her inflammation, but when she has it, she does not groom herself and it is a problem.

We are going with pumpkin.

I have not seen any blood in her urine since the February incident but she has had a few bad days since her enema where she has exhibited symptoms of an inflamed bladder.

One other thing I have noticed is that Catnip works better than amitriptolyn for her pain.

[critters]

Interesting! Never thought of catnip for that purpose.